Tue. Nov 04, 2003
Got Guns? Got God?
Got Guns? Got God? – Kennesaw is a city of about 20,000 people on the outskirts of Atlanta. A couple of decades ago, the City Council made national headlines when they mandated by legislation that all Kennesaw citizens own a gun.
”The north Cobb County city that has long been a battleground in the culture wars fired another shot Monday after the council unanimously approved a resolution to ’urge all American citizens to proclaim to every level of government … its responsibility to publicly recognize God as the foundation of our national heritage …’”
It seems clear this was partially inspired by the recent history of disputes over issues like the display of the Ten Commandments on government property. While I suppose there is no great harm in this non-binding resolution, it’s also clear that when people say that God is ”the foundation of our national heritage,” recent history is the limit of their knowledge.
”The United States is in no sense founded upon the Christian doctrine.”
When it comes to arguments about what is the foundation of our national heritage, excuse me if I side with the words of George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, and this nation’s ”Founding Fathers,” rather than a non-binding resolution from the Kennesaw City Council.
And before you assume this is merely a stand of principle, consider the resolution’s timing and primary backer. The resolution passed the night before election day, and Mayor Leonard Church, who is coincidentally up for re-election today, says ”I’m the one that started the proclamation, and have heard nothing but positive support.”
Kennesaw businessman Peter Norwood Popham begs to differ: ”This is nothing more than a political ploy to gather votes for [Church’s] floundering re-election campaign … All of us without question love our God and many love our guns, but these are not the issues in [today’s] city elections.”
But to me, this is the most telling part: ”The resolution has nothing to do with politics, Church said. ’I wish I could have done it last year,’ he said, adding the issue wasn’t as urgent at the time.”
God only became an urgent issue the night before the election. Sounds like a man prayin’ for salvation, to me. Nothing wrong with that, but no need to legislate it.
Published 07:53AM, Tue, Nov 04 2003
Category: Politics
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Peanut Gallery
I like stuff like this because it serves as a "roll call" in the community. We can't paint the Scarlet Letter on Pinko Commie Athiests anymore, so they tend to slip under the radar. A good devisive stunt like this smokes em out for all to see. Down here in the south, we like our enemies out in the open where we can see 'em.
If I found self-serving "joe-mccarthy-community-rollcalls" to be anything more than lunatic fringe wacked out extremist demented behavior in the South, I wouldn't still be here after 25 years. Trust me on this one.
I decided that anyone who thinks those who agree with Washington, Jefferson, and Madison is a "Pinko Commie Atheist" was either trolling, or unworthy of engagement. Because surely no thinking person would assume that everyone who believes in the separation of chruch and state, as mandated by our Constitution for over two centuries, is also a "Pinko Commie Atheist." And like you, Richard, in the 27 years I've lived in the South as an adult, I've not seen any "community rollcalls" either. Well, other than the one last night during the Democratic debate on the subject of the "Confederate flag." But that was just eight guys, and only a couple of them are from the South. Whatever the reason for this resolution, the result was that your neighbor Leonard got 71% of the 1,572 votes cast for mayor. And I also discovered that the guy the AJC described as just a local businessman, Peter Popham, was actually Leonard's mayoral opponent. A minor omission, eh? Now there's some fine and complete reporting from our sole local newspaper on the day of the election.
Some of those "Pinko Communist Athiests" who live dangerously close to Kennesaw are a lot more armed and ready for the revolution than the Bible Thumping, Sociopath Control Freaks can possibly imagine. I am not Pink. I am not Communist. However, I do not believe in any god, no matter how you spell it. I am not alone. Before you come for us, oh vigilant one, make peace with your god. For you are going to need a lot more than a paint brush. Pray to your god all you want, but keep it out of my government.
I know the person who drafted the first proclamation passed in Greene county TN. Have any of the previous commentators seen the entire proclamation? Commentary based on factual information, may proceed. "WHEREAS, our Government was founded upon a trust in God that began when our Founding Fathers proclaimed in America's first official document our Declaration of Independence, that our rights to 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness' were not given to us by government, but by God 'our Creator,' the 'Sovereign Judge of the Universe,' and, WHEREAS, it is a fact that between 90 and 95 percent of those who drafted and signed the United States Constitution had a strong belief and trust in God and never ever intended that there be a separation between HIM and the affairs of Government, only that each citizen be free to choose on a personal basis how to worship, or if to worship, and, WHEREAS, the recognition of God by our Government was further established when Congress, in 1954, added the phrase 'ONE NATION UNDER GOD' to our Pledge of Allegiance, followed in 1956 by the official establishment of 'IN GOD WE TRUST' as our National Motto, and, WHEREAS, there is now a growing demand by some within the Judicial System to remove all visible recognition of God from public institutions, which recently resulted in a Federal Order to physically remove the Ten Commandments Monument from the Alabama State Supreme Court, rightfully placed there by the Chief Justice of the Alabama State Supreme Court to remind all that God is central to our National Heritage, and His Ten Commandments, without question, the foundation of American law, moral values and code of conduct, THEREFORE, we urge all American citizens to proclaim to every level of Government (Local, State and Federal) its responsibility to publicly recognize God as the foundation of our national heritage - LEST OUR NATION FORGET AND OUR CHILDREN NEVER KNOW!"
Thank you for posting the content of that resolution (though I was unaware that Kennesaw was adopting the exact same wording). But any half-hearted student of American History can see it is full of holes. "WHEREAS, it is a fact that between 90 and 95 percent of those who drafted and signed the United States Constitution had a strong belief and trust in God and never ever intended that there be a separation between HIM and the affairs of Government, only that each citizen be free to choose on a personal basis how to worship, or if to worship." Our Founding Fathers never intended a separation of church and state? That is historical revisionism of Gold Medal Quality. It stands in complete ignorance of a huge body of stated positions by our Founding Fathers (emphasis mine): "Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God; that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship; that the legislative powers of the government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between church and state." — Thomas Jefferson "The government of the United States is in no sense founded upon the Christian religion." - Treaty of Tripoli, 1797 "The United States is in no sense founded upon the Christian doctrine." - George Washington "The number, the industry, and the morality of the priesthood, and the devotion of the people, have been manifestly increased by the total separation of church and state." -- James Madison And perhaps most importantly: "Who does not see that the same authority which can establish Christianity, in exclusion of all other religions, may establish with the same ease any particular sect of Christians, in exclusion of all other Sects?" — James Madison, "Memorial and Remonstrance," 1785. What will you do when some government body wants to establish that Catholicism is the only acceptable form of Christianity in American. Scream that they can't do that because of the separation of church and state? Oops, you tossed that little Constitutional device. Go ahead, say that will never happen. That's what our Founding Fathers said over 200 years ago ... the US government will never dictate religion in any way. Yet here you are trying to legislate Christianity as the Official Faith of America, in total defiance of the words of our Founding Fathers. You might want to refresh your junior high civics education about how this country started, because you'll find a host of quotes like the above. And that's just the examples from the one page I quickly linked within this entry. There are literal books on the topic. "THEREFORE, we urge all American citizens to proclaim to every level of Government (Local, State and Federal) its responsibility to publicly recognize God as the foundation of our national heritage - LEST OUR NATION FORGET AND OUR CHILDREN NEVER KNOW!" The only way the children won't know is if their parents don't teach them. You are still in favor of parents being the primary source of religious choice for their children, aren't you? It's their parents who are supposed to be teaching them these things, right? Or is that something the government is supposed to do as well? Why isn't your own proclamation of faith ... enough? Why do you feel that your government must also proclaim that faith ... even if it isn't representative of all Americans (Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, etc.)? Do you also harangue your boss at work to get the company to proclaim God is a foundation of their business? If not, why not? Is it OK to keep your business separate from your religious proclamations? It's one thing to lead your life by your religious beliefs in your everyday activities and business. It's another thing to force it on others. Personally, I don't want my government in my bedroom, or in my church (and in my business as little as possible). Those are very private places, and very much about individual choice. I don't care what the President says about religion. I don't care what some City Council says about religion. I don't care what my boss says about religion. That is my individual choice. And I find it most perverse that it is usually those on the right who supposedly stand for "small government" who are most likely to suggest the government should get involved in an private area where it never has, in over two centuries.
Excellent points based on factual information. I cut, and pasted the original text without any change of format. I will post one quote that I think, sums up my personal opinion concerning the debate. "My name is Ozymandius, King of Kings, Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair! Nothing beside remains. Round the decay Of that colossal Wreck, boundless and bare The lone and level sands stretch far away." Ozymandius by Percy Bysshe Shelley Governments come and go.
By the way, I am lettered; B.A. In History(major.), and Political Science(minor). I admire the research you provided, quotes with citations, Very professional, better than my junior high civics text book. - Andy



Oh, the decisions we make..... 2 years ago I was almost in a coin-flipping situation. Let's see...hmmmm....Taos? or Kennesaw? Santa Fe? or Kennesaw? Moab? or Kennesaw.....hmmmmm. Oh the tragedy. I wish I read your article this morning before the polls closed. As it was, I knew nothing about any of the candidates except that they were probably all Republicans & Leonard lived in my subdivision so he probably wasn't all that bad. I skipped the election and worked feverishly to ship orders, finishing a few minutes ago at 10:00. Now I'm thinking maybe this is why I don't seem to fit in with any of my neighbors. I'm sure they all voted.